Hi everyone,
We recently received the following letter. You're welcome to respond.
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Really?
From: Amy
To: The Path of Truth
Date: 2/22/2015 3:50 AM
I was interested in what you had to say about false prophets. I agree with many of the names on your list and have personally witnessed the false teaching from prosperity evangelists, but you are quick to judge and add names to this list! Clearly you added Clayton Jennings on a whim based an email from a random person. I don't know if he is a false prophet. All I have heard from him is that everyone needs Jesus. Maybe I will hear him speak, then decide if he contradicts the Bible or points the audience to Satan. Regardless, I will leave that to God as He will separate the wheat from the chaff.
When you include Billy Graham on a list with Oprah and Jesse Duplantis, you lose all credibility. I am a Christian! I grew up hearing Graham speak the TRUTH and have no doubt God uses him to add many souls to His flock. What you seem to miss is that these people are all flawed human beings created by God. Will they make a mistake unworthy of a follower of Christ or one who teaches about Christ? Yes!!! We are saved by Grace, not by works. I tried to find what Godly purpose your sight serves. Are you pointing people in the direction of a loving but just God? Will anyone find an eternal relationship with JESUS after reading your posts? Not likely. Then what are you doing and why? Who are you to determine who is sent by God to teach? You would also have more credibility if you quoted KJV rather than MSG translation.
Fwd: Really?
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Edwin Romero
Re: Fwd: Really?
Hello Amy,
It is understandable that you agree with many names rightly put on the false prophets list. It is expected in mainline Christianity where, while everyone endorses others just because they claim to be Christians and go to church, they disagree with each other on crucial issues, thus creating more division among themselves all the time. Yet Christ is not divided.
Clayton Jennings, on a whim, discarded the message sent to him confronting his carnal works. He also discarded the Lord’s servants as soon as, or sooner than, he discarded the message. What credit can he have as a man of God with good judgment and discernment? When I look at his FB page, the man is clearly a hero, saving thousands everywhere. He sounds so busy and excited that he won’t be distracted even by the Lord Himself. Yet those people love to believe pleasant lies; there’s no mentioning of taking up the cross or self-denial for the Lord's sake with Jennings.
You say, “Maybe I will hear him speak, then decide if he contradicts the Bible or points the audience to Satan.” Do you realize this is a very naïve declaration? When have you heard a false prophet trying to deceive even the elect by pointing them to Satan or by contradicting the Bible? I can tell you they actually do that, but in such a manner that the deceived don’t even suspect it; otherwise, they wouldn’t be deceived.
“For false Christs and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders; so much so that, if it were possible, they would deceive even the elect” (Mathew 24:24 MKJV)
You also mention that human mistakes are the issues being addressed by Victor and Paul at the Path of Truth. Not even close. The problem with false Christians in general is not their human flaws, which we all have; the problem is what they present as the righteousness of God, while it is their own. The problem is the glory they claim to be giving to the Lord, when it is to themselves and other men.
“And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God” (Luke 16:15 MKJV).
I am just one witness that The Path of Truth is not about any man’s purpose, but the Lord’s. He has commissioned His servants to expose the works of darkness which cannot be seen by those doing or using them. Darkness can only be exposed by shining the Light, which is Jesus Christ, the Light and Judge of all men. His judgment serves the purpose of convicting, correcting, and ultimately saving everyone, according to His wise purpose.
“And Enoch, the seventh from Adam, also prophesied to these, saying, Behold, the Lord came with myriads of His saints, to do judgment against all, and to rebuke all the ungodly of them concerning all their ungodly works which they ungodly did, and concerning all the hard things ungodly sinners spoke against Him.” (Jude 1:14 MKJV)
Several of us here have experienced the Lord’s judgment as an expression of His love, finding deliverance from much evil afflicting us (and we afflicting others) for years while in men’s churches, some even doing “admirable works for the Lord.” And the process goes on by His grace.
“Are you pointing people in the direction of a loving but just God?” Why is it that “Christians” always present the concepts of love and justice as opposites? Is there not justice in love or love in justice? God is love; therefore, He is justice as well. Consider.
And could you answer this question yourself? “Who are you to determine who is sent by God to teach?” Do you realize that’s exactly what you’re doing, while acknowledging the Lord Jesus has not commissioned you to do that?
As for Bible references, if you are really interested in knowing, you can read on this section: http://www.thepathoftruth.com/teachings ... ptures.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It is understandable that you agree with many names rightly put on the false prophets list. It is expected in mainline Christianity where, while everyone endorses others just because they claim to be Christians and go to church, they disagree with each other on crucial issues, thus creating more division among themselves all the time. Yet Christ is not divided.
Clayton Jennings, on a whim, discarded the message sent to him confronting his carnal works. He also discarded the Lord’s servants as soon as, or sooner than, he discarded the message. What credit can he have as a man of God with good judgment and discernment? When I look at his FB page, the man is clearly a hero, saving thousands everywhere. He sounds so busy and excited that he won’t be distracted even by the Lord Himself. Yet those people love to believe pleasant lies; there’s no mentioning of taking up the cross or self-denial for the Lord's sake with Jennings.
You say, “Maybe I will hear him speak, then decide if he contradicts the Bible or points the audience to Satan.” Do you realize this is a very naïve declaration? When have you heard a false prophet trying to deceive even the elect by pointing them to Satan or by contradicting the Bible? I can tell you they actually do that, but in such a manner that the deceived don’t even suspect it; otherwise, they wouldn’t be deceived.
“For false Christs and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders; so much so that, if it were possible, they would deceive even the elect” (Mathew 24:24 MKJV)
You also mention that human mistakes are the issues being addressed by Victor and Paul at the Path of Truth. Not even close. The problem with false Christians in general is not their human flaws, which we all have; the problem is what they present as the righteousness of God, while it is their own. The problem is the glory they claim to be giving to the Lord, when it is to themselves and other men.
“And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God” (Luke 16:15 MKJV).
I am just one witness that The Path of Truth is not about any man’s purpose, but the Lord’s. He has commissioned His servants to expose the works of darkness which cannot be seen by those doing or using them. Darkness can only be exposed by shining the Light, which is Jesus Christ, the Light and Judge of all men. His judgment serves the purpose of convicting, correcting, and ultimately saving everyone, according to His wise purpose.
“And Enoch, the seventh from Adam, also prophesied to these, saying, Behold, the Lord came with myriads of His saints, to do judgment against all, and to rebuke all the ungodly of them concerning all their ungodly works which they ungodly did, and concerning all the hard things ungodly sinners spoke against Him.” (Jude 1:14 MKJV)
Several of us here have experienced the Lord’s judgment as an expression of His love, finding deliverance from much evil afflicting us (and we afflicting others) for years while in men’s churches, some even doing “admirable works for the Lord.” And the process goes on by His grace.
“Are you pointing people in the direction of a loving but just God?” Why is it that “Christians” always present the concepts of love and justice as opposites? Is there not justice in love or love in justice? God is love; therefore, He is justice as well. Consider.
And could you answer this question yourself? “Who are you to determine who is sent by God to teach?” Do you realize that’s exactly what you’re doing, while acknowledging the Lord Jesus has not commissioned you to do that?
As for Bible references, if you are really interested in knowing, you can read on this section: http://www.thepathoftruth.com/teachings ... ptures.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Brian McDonald
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:52 am
- Location: Ireland
Re: Fwd: Really?
To Amy
Dear Amy, I have often wondered what it would be like to go back in time and have the great honour and grace of having been present while the apostles were speaking and teaching. How great a privilege would it have been to be standing in some congregation as Paul the apostle, aka, Saul of Tarsus was giving one of his many sermons on Christ. What blessings would have flowed into my ears and my heart, filling me with Amazing Grace. In awe and trembling would I have listened as he spoke with all the authority and power of the Holy Spirit. Words of Life emanating from his mouth, but also words of death when needed. Words that could build up and tear down. Words that could cut one to the bone and heal another. Words that could encourage the faithful to high honour, or dismiss the mocker in great shame. Words of loving zeal for the house of God and words of anger and warning for the enemies of Christ; the false teachers, of which Paul reminded us, were many, even in his day.
Now Amy, moving forward 2000 years, you come here, into this congregation of the Body of Christ and with no authority and no power but your own. You insult and judge things you know nothing of. Perhaps you expected something different, as I am sure many did in those faithful days when the apostles, Peter, John, Paul and all the others were in the flesh and preaching the word of Christ.
Many indeed would have been horrified at the words they spoke. “How can this be?” they would have protested, gnashing their teeth and wringing their hands. If I were you Amy, I would think again about how you perceive what a man of God is, or how he should speak, or how he should judge. The angels of God, pure angelic creatures they may be, have been known to slay almost countless numbers without mercy, without compassion. Perhaps you think that unfair or hateful.
Amy, you speak as one who has no understanding, no fear, no clue. Ignorant of the Holy Spirit, whose presence you have stumbled into, or rather, been brought to, for your own good.
You call God a “loving but just God” and you would be right to do so. However, you know nothing of Him. Our God corrects His children. He admonishes them. He cuts to the bone and then heals again, as He will do with you, when the time is right. As He is doing with me now, even as I write these words to you in His Name.
Brian.
Dear Amy, I have often wondered what it would be like to go back in time and have the great honour and grace of having been present while the apostles were speaking and teaching. How great a privilege would it have been to be standing in some congregation as Paul the apostle, aka, Saul of Tarsus was giving one of his many sermons on Christ. What blessings would have flowed into my ears and my heart, filling me with Amazing Grace. In awe and trembling would I have listened as he spoke with all the authority and power of the Holy Spirit. Words of Life emanating from his mouth, but also words of death when needed. Words that could build up and tear down. Words that could cut one to the bone and heal another. Words that could encourage the faithful to high honour, or dismiss the mocker in great shame. Words of loving zeal for the house of God and words of anger and warning for the enemies of Christ; the false teachers, of which Paul reminded us, were many, even in his day.
Now Amy, moving forward 2000 years, you come here, into this congregation of the Body of Christ and with no authority and no power but your own. You insult and judge things you know nothing of. Perhaps you expected something different, as I am sure many did in those faithful days when the apostles, Peter, John, Paul and all the others were in the flesh and preaching the word of Christ.
Many indeed would have been horrified at the words they spoke. “How can this be?” they would have protested, gnashing their teeth and wringing their hands. If I were you Amy, I would think again about how you perceive what a man of God is, or how he should speak, or how he should judge. The angels of God, pure angelic creatures they may be, have been known to slay almost countless numbers without mercy, without compassion. Perhaps you think that unfair or hateful.
Amy, you speak as one who has no understanding, no fear, no clue. Ignorant of the Holy Spirit, whose presence you have stumbled into, or rather, been brought to, for your own good.
You call God a “loving but just God” and you would be right to do so. However, you know nothing of Him. Our God corrects His children. He admonishes them. He cuts to the bone and then heals again, as He will do with you, when the time is right. As He is doing with me now, even as I write these words to you in His Name.
Brian.
Last edited by Brian McDonald on Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Paul Cohen
Re: Fwd: Really?
I emailed Amy both Edwin's and Brian's responses to her letter. She replied after Brian's response:
"And this is why I will NOT join your forum. Please do not send me any more emails from your arrogant rude and condescending colleagues. I do not expect or accept verbal abuse from any man and certainly not one who thinks he is speaking with the enlightenment of the Holy Spirit. I am disgusted. Don't send me any more emails. Such a bunch of hateful hypocrits. I know Jesus. I know God and I know the Holy Spirit. You all need to find better things to do with your time."
I wrote back:
Amy,
I have things to say to you, whether you shut your ears or not. You initiated this conversation and continue to make accusations without substance.
“Such is the way of an adulterous woman; she eats, and wipes her mouth, and says, I have done no evil” (Proverbs 30:20 MKJV).
You can walk away wiping your mouth as if you haven’t spoken evil, but you won’t escape God’s judgment on your wickedness, and we won’t have your blood on our hands because we’ve told you the truth.
Here’s my original letter to you, which I wrote before posting your letter on the forum:
If you don’t know whether Clayton Jennings is a false prophet, what are you doing passing judgment on the judgment the Lord has given of him? We have already shown how Clayton contradicts the Bible and points people to himself. Did you not read our posting, or couldn’t you hear what it’s saying?
“If one answers a matter before he hears, it is folly and shame to him” (Proverbs 18:13 MKJV).
You know nothing at all of the Lord or His ways.
What we have uncovered with Clayton Jennings and Billy Graham isn’t that they’re flawed human beings, which all are, but that they’re liars, counterfeiters who’ve taken the Name of Christ in vain.
2 Corinthians 11:13-15 EMTV
(13) For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ.
(14) And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.
(15) Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.
The flaws of the saints serve to glorify God, because they’ve taken up the cross to follow Him and live by His power.
“And He said to me, My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore I will rather glory in my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may overshadow me. Therefore I am pleased in weaknesses, in insults, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake; for when I am weak, then I am powerful” (2 Corinthians 12:9-10 MKJV).
Who are we to determine who is sent by God to teach? You hypocrite – who are you to determine whom God sends? We give substance and righteous judgment, whereas you give empty opinion, judging by your carnal sight.
Would we have more credibility with you if we quoted the KJV? We do quote from it (including the Modern KJV), more than any other translation on our site, but we don’t want your approval, which is obviously corrupt and displeasing to God.
“And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God” (Luke 16:15 MKJV).
Paul
"And this is why I will NOT join your forum. Please do not send me any more emails from your arrogant rude and condescending colleagues. I do not expect or accept verbal abuse from any man and certainly not one who thinks he is speaking with the enlightenment of the Holy Spirit. I am disgusted. Don't send me any more emails. Such a bunch of hateful hypocrits. I know Jesus. I know God and I know the Holy Spirit. You all need to find better things to do with your time."
I wrote back:
Amy,
I have things to say to you, whether you shut your ears or not. You initiated this conversation and continue to make accusations without substance.
“Such is the way of an adulterous woman; she eats, and wipes her mouth, and says, I have done no evil” (Proverbs 30:20 MKJV).
You can walk away wiping your mouth as if you haven’t spoken evil, but you won’t escape God’s judgment on your wickedness, and we won’t have your blood on our hands because we’ve told you the truth.
Here’s my original letter to you, which I wrote before posting your letter on the forum:
If you don’t know whether Clayton Jennings is a false prophet, what are you doing passing judgment on the judgment the Lord has given of him? We have already shown how Clayton contradicts the Bible and points people to himself. Did you not read our posting, or couldn’t you hear what it’s saying?
“If one answers a matter before he hears, it is folly and shame to him” (Proverbs 18:13 MKJV).
You know nothing at all of the Lord or His ways.
What we have uncovered with Clayton Jennings and Billy Graham isn’t that they’re flawed human beings, which all are, but that they’re liars, counterfeiters who’ve taken the Name of Christ in vain.
2 Corinthians 11:13-15 EMTV
(13) For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ.
(14) And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.
(15) Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.
The flaws of the saints serve to glorify God, because they’ve taken up the cross to follow Him and live by His power.
“And He said to me, My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore I will rather glory in my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may overshadow me. Therefore I am pleased in weaknesses, in insults, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake; for when I am weak, then I am powerful” (2 Corinthians 12:9-10 MKJV).
Who are we to determine who is sent by God to teach? You hypocrite – who are you to determine whom God sends? We give substance and righteous judgment, whereas you give empty opinion, judging by your carnal sight.
Would we have more credibility with you if we quoted the KJV? We do quote from it (including the Modern KJV), more than any other translation on our site, but we don’t want your approval, which is obviously corrupt and displeasing to God.
“And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God” (Luke 16:15 MKJV).
Paul
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Kim Barthel
Re: Fwd: Really?
Just popping in to say there is much information available to suggest that Billy Graham is/was an upper level Freemason. He was holding hands with Satan while professing to offer words from God. Many a perverse man has hidden his own dark intentions and dabblings behind the veneer of evangelism. Power corrupts ... Graham had much power and influence. God allowed Graham's ministry and perhaps "some" listeners were planted with the seed of Truth ... but that is God's doing ... certainly not Billy Graham's doing.
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Paul Cohen
Re: Fwd: Really?
Hi Kim and welcome to the forum!
Consider this: We’ve never heard Billy Graham admit to being a high-degree Mason, but he has been holding hands with Satan openly in public from the beginning of his religious career. In preparation for a crusade in New York in 1957 he said:
“I have many friends among Catholic priests, and a number of New York Catholic leaders have written me stating that they believe New York needs a spiritual awakening, and have promised me their prayers and interest even though they could not officially support the meetings, The Catholic Church has always been as friendly and as tolerant as their church law will allow them toward our crusades.”
This relationship grew over the years. Before a crusade in London in 1989, Cardinal Basil Hume of the Church of England said this about Billy Graham’s works:
“We are, as the Catholic Church in this country, working as closely as we can with Billy Graham in his Mission '89...The view I take is that I believe the grace of God is at work in the Mission and, if it helps people return to their own churches, then that is good.”
Billy Graham is a good friend to all the works of men, which are called by God “the paths of the destroyer” (Psalm 17:4). You can’t get any closer to Satan – the one who transforms himself into an angel of light - than promoting his works and workers. Graham said of the Pope in 1979:
“The visit of Pope Paul II to the United States is an event of great significance not only for Roman Catholics, but for all Americans - as well as the world... In the short time he has been Pope, John Paul II has become the moral leader of the world. My prayers and the prayer of countless other Protestants will be with him as he makes his journey.”
So, whether a Mason or not, Graham has made his allegiance clear, if God gives us the grace to see and hear. That’s what He did with Victor in the 1970’s, when he asked the Lord about Graham - How the Lord Exposed Billy Graham.
And you’re right that people can be positively affected by the truth they hear from whoever, including from Satan. God is over all and all things serve Him and His purposes.
Paul
Consider this: We’ve never heard Billy Graham admit to being a high-degree Mason, but he has been holding hands with Satan openly in public from the beginning of his religious career. In preparation for a crusade in New York in 1957 he said:
“I have many friends among Catholic priests, and a number of New York Catholic leaders have written me stating that they believe New York needs a spiritual awakening, and have promised me their prayers and interest even though they could not officially support the meetings, The Catholic Church has always been as friendly and as tolerant as their church law will allow them toward our crusades.”
This relationship grew over the years. Before a crusade in London in 1989, Cardinal Basil Hume of the Church of England said this about Billy Graham’s works:
“We are, as the Catholic Church in this country, working as closely as we can with Billy Graham in his Mission '89...The view I take is that I believe the grace of God is at work in the Mission and, if it helps people return to their own churches, then that is good.”
Billy Graham is a good friend to all the works of men, which are called by God “the paths of the destroyer” (Psalm 17:4). You can’t get any closer to Satan – the one who transforms himself into an angel of light - than promoting his works and workers. Graham said of the Pope in 1979:
“The visit of Pope Paul II to the United States is an event of great significance not only for Roman Catholics, but for all Americans - as well as the world... In the short time he has been Pope, John Paul II has become the moral leader of the world. My prayers and the prayer of countless other Protestants will be with him as he makes his journey.”
So, whether a Mason or not, Graham has made his allegiance clear, if God gives us the grace to see and hear. That’s what He did with Victor in the 1970’s, when he asked the Lord about Graham - How the Lord Exposed Billy Graham.
And you’re right that people can be positively affected by the truth they hear from whoever, including from Satan. God is over all and all things serve Him and His purposes.
Paul
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Piet Barnard
Re: Fwd: Really?
With this last answer you condemned both Peter and Paul - They also agreed to disagree because if they did agree who would have all been Jews according to Peter, and the gospel never would have spread across the world by Paul. Not all of us are perfect or think we are perfect but we know that Jesus voice comes with love not by throwing stones at everyone that don t believe exactly like you want us to believe.
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Paul Cohen
Re: Fwd: Really?
You’re wrong, Piet. Peter and Paul didn’t agree to disagree. Paul rebuked Peter (see Galatians 2) – how is that agreement? And Peter received the correction, later commending Paul’s teaching as the Word of God:Piet Barnard wrote:With this last answer you condemned both Peter and Paul - They also agreed to disagree because if they did agree who would have all been Jews according to Peter, and the gospel never would have spread across the world by Paul. Not all of us are perfect or think we are perfect but we know that Jesus voice comes with love not by throwing stones at everyone that don t believe exactly like you want us to believe.
“And think of the long-suffering of our Lord as salvation (as our beloved brother Paul also has written to you according to the wisdom given to him as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction)” (2 Peter 3:15-16 MKJV).
Peter didn’t believe or teach that the Gospel should only go to the Jews. He was the one, after all, to whom the Lord gave a vision and instruction to preach to the Gentiles. Peter obeyed, as recorded in Acts 10 and 11. And later on, when certain Judaizers were troubling Gentile believers, the matter was brought before the apostles in Jerusalem, Peter had this to say in response to the Jews who preached circumcision:
Acts 15:7-11 MKJV
(7) And after much disputing, Peter rose up and said to them, Men, brothers, you recognize that from ancient days God chose among us that through my mouth the nations should hear the Word of the Gospel, and believe.
(8) And God, Who knows the hearts, bore them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit even as to us.
(9) And He put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
(10) Now therefore why do you tempt God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples, a yoke which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
(11) But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, according to which manner they also believed.
You’re the one throwing stones of false accusation, Piet, whereas all we have done is exposed a false teacher who promotes himself and not the Lord Jesus Christ.
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Victor Hafichuk
- Posts: 749
- Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:07 am
Re: Fwd: Really?
Piet, in the section on the trinity you speak of teaching. How is it you presume to teach while being so ignorant of the Scriptures, speaking foolishness that is so easily discerned as false by the Word of God? Don't you realize you'll give an account for this serious trespass against God? How is it you can claim to be born again, not having the Spirit to give you understanding as a believer, much less a preacher of Christ? You deceive and condemn yourself.