God created evil??????

Correspondence regarding The Purpose of Evil.

God created evil??????

Postby Kee » Mon Dec 15, 2014 4:23 pm



Your statement of Doctrine states:

God had created evil as a necessary experience for man's spiritual education and perfection. (The Purpose of Evil)

If God created evil to tempt us then He is responsible for our sins. This would make God satan, as satan is the father of evil. When God was done creating all that He created He said it is GOOD.

Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

It is not till after Adam and Eve ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil that sin enters the world. Before they ate of the tree they were naked and not ashamed.

Genesis 2:25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.

It is after eating of the tree that things change

Genesis 3:10 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.

They were afraid. This shows us evil entered the world. See God did not create the evil as you say, evil came about as a result of the knowledge of good and evil.

It is the knowledge that created the evil not God. For God to create evil then He is not ALL GOOD. He is also part evil and thus His son Jesus would be part evil and could not be sinless and be a sacrifice. Otherwise it is not possible for God to have created evil.


Matthew 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

This shows us God could not create evil because He is good. If God were to have created evil then He would be the corrupt tree. Maybe you aught to consider that you actually worship evil and not God as you believe your god created evil. Satan (satan being the knowledge of evil) is the father of all things evil not God.

I hope you see that God cannot be the creator of evil and then you can see God for the loving being that He is.
Kee
 

Re: God created evil??????

Postby Victor Hafichuk » Sat Dec 20, 2014 8:49 am



ME, we well understand your arguments, but you don't understand what we're saying. You need to read the paper again, perhaps several times, all the while keeping in mind the factual declarations of the Scriptures.

How can there be knowledge of something that doesn't exist? If there was knowledge of evil, there would of necessity be evil to know. God placed the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil before there was any sin.

All things, the Bible declares in several places, were created by God. “All” means all in this case (not all cases).

Isaiah 45:5-7 MKJV
(5) I am the LORD, and there is none else, no God besides Me; I clothed you, though you have not known Me;
(6) that they may know from the rising of the sun, and to the sunset, that there is none besides Me. I am the LORD, and there is none else;
(7) forming the light and creating darkness; making peace and creating evil. I the LORD do all these things.

“All things came into being through Him, and without Him not even one thing came into being that has come into being” (John 1:3 MKJV).

God is Love. We know Him. You don't. Repent of yourself, your knowledge and pride, ME.

Victor
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Re: God created evil??????

Postby Paul Cohen » Sat Dec 20, 2014 8:50 am



If God created evil to tempt us then He is responsible for our sins.

It appears you haven't red the article (The Purpose of Evil) thoroughly or well enough to notice that your objections are answered there according to the Scriptures. God created the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil before Adam sinned, as well as the serpent (Satan), whom Jesus described as a murderer from the beginning. God made him that way.

And yes, it all was good. You assume otherwise, but you're wrong. “For the creation was not willingly subjected to vanity, but because of Him Who subjected it on hope…” (Romans 8:20 MKJV).

You're also wrong to assume that because God creates evil, He is evil.

Isaiah 45:5-7 MKJV
(5) I am the LORD, and there is none else, no God besides Me; I clothed you, though you have not known Me;
(6) that they may know from the rising of the sun, and to the sunset, that there is none besides Me. I am the LORD, and there is none else;
(7) forming the light and creating darkness; making peace and creating evil. I the LORD do all these things.

If God isn't omnipotent and totally sovereign, then He isn't the God He says He is and must be in order to be working ALL things together for good.

“And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose” (Romans 8:28 MKJV).

Does this mean truth and goodness prevail only for those who love God, or that those who love God know truth and goodness prevail over all? The Scriptures declare the latter:

“But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound, so that as sin has reigned to death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord” (Romans 5:20-21 MKJV).

Hmmm, so God is telling us that His grace will reign through righteousness to eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord anywhere where sin has reigned to death. Looks like that leaves out… nothing and no one.

“For God has shut up all in unbelief, so that He might show mercy to all” (Romans 11:32 MKJV).

How will everyone come to know His goodness and love, had they not been subjected to their own evil and its consequences? Think about it, Ma Searing. You're out of line with His righteousness and declaration of what is.

A grateful sinner shown mercy, declaring Him alone Who is good and rules over all,

Paul Cohen
www.ThePathofTruth.com
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Re: God created evil??????

Postby Kee » Sat Dec 27, 2014 4:43 pm



Why is it because I have knowledge means I need to repent of pride???? Did not the bible tell us to study to show ourselves approved?

It is always the same if one does not agree with those who are haughty then they are called prideful. So predictable.

If you were to look at the bible you would see what God said Genesis 3:22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Your argument is faulty from the beginning.

You said "How can there be knowledge of something that doesn't exist? If there was knowledge of evil, there would of necessity be evil to know. God placed the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil before there was any sin. "

Notice one word here KNOWLEDGE. The tree of knowledge was placed in the garden. Not the tree of evil.

In Isaiah He also said God created darkness. Excuse me it was dark and God created light if you read Genesis. Darkness is the absences of light as evil is the absence of love. So these can only be created by removing light or good. God did not remove His light from man nor did He remove His good from man.

And as I said and you seemed to have missed Jesus said satan is the father of evil. Since God is our father and creator then this would make satan the father and creator of evil. Your belief is based on faulty logic. Go back and read what Jesus said about satan being the father of evil and you will see your MISTAKE.

Looking at it from your perspective this would mean then evil is good for all that is in the garden was good. Knowledge is good not evil. Besides Evil is not a thing. It is a concept. God did not created concepts.

To help you understand better evil is not something that can even be created, it is like saying something is perfect. Nothing can really be perfect because what is perfect to you is probably not perfect to me. So it is not perfect. Perfect does not really exist any more then evil. For they are both in our minds as thoughts. You either act or do not act on thoughts.

It is through the knowledge of what is good and evil that we have knowledge of what is or is not evil. But evil is not a thing thus cannot be created. Knowledge is really only information. God created us in His image which means we are able to understand good and evil if we are given the knowledge. So evil is nothing more then thoughts and the result of actions taken by someone. So how can God create evil?

Let me ask you something God created man for fellowship so why would He then create something that would separate us from Him? Seems a bit far fetched for Him to do this. God was in fellowship with Adam and Eve in the garden. He had what He created man for. So it seems a bit foolish to sabotage what He wanted. He went to the extend of creating a whole universe and world and all the things in the world so He could create man, then He turns around and trashes it and hurts those He says He loves. I don't know about you but this is not the God I worship. That is just plain sick.

The law showed us we have a need for a savior to reunite us with God away from sin. For it is the sin that separates us from God. Sin came about because of the knowledge of good and evil. So many people do not understand this simple statement. If there is no knowledge of good and evil then people being made by God to be good would not know that something was evil(bad).

We see with Cain and Abel this very thing. Cain got angry at Abel because he thought Abel was trying to hurt him by doing better then Cain. So Cain saw things other then lovingly. If there was no knowledge of evil and only of good then Cain would not have gotten angry at Abel. Cain would not have known to get angry. We can see this with children and how they see things as good until they are taught they are not good.

God warned Cain about the anger. Otherwise the anger (the thoughts) led Cain to sin. There was no evil force that made Cain sin. He chose to sin just as we all do but so often people do not want to admit they felt that way so they have to have someone to blame. Christianity is very happy to give us something to blame, a fallen angel is to blame they say. The fallen angels name is supposedly Lucifer. Do you even know what the name Lucifer means. You might be surprised if you were to look it up.

To say God created evil is like saying good is evil. It just does not work. I will take what Jesus said over Isaiah and stick with what Jesus taught. Will you take man words, even though a prophets words over Jesus? Remember Isaiah was having a temper tantrum and wanted people to listen to him so he spoke of an omnipotent God. It is like saying just because Jesus said God can destroy our soul does not mean He will. Just because I could kill someone does not mean I have a desire or that I would. You need to stop seeing demons around every corner. But more important you need to get off the haughty attitude so you can learn things.

Your suggesting that I am prideful is showing you do not have Jesus in your heart and that you are bearing rotten fruit.
Kee
 

Re: God created evil??????

Postby Victor Hafichuk » Tue Jan 06, 2015 8:59 am



ME, you fully misunderstand and falsely judge what we teach. That is because you've never received the Spirit of the Lord. You don't know Him and He doesn't know you. You've fallen prey to another Jesus and another gospel, as so many have.

Would you read:

The Purpose of Evil
The Good News
The Baptism in the Holy Spirit
How One Is Saved and
Here Is the Way It Is?

Victor
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Re: God created evil??????

Postby Kee » Tue Jan 06, 2015 9:43 am



Victor

So you are the true god then since you know my heart and that I am deceived by a fake god. Wow what is it like to be so powerful that you can direct the Spirit and know all that He does? To think you know so much is a bit arrogant don't ya think?? Jesus says do not judge lest ye be judged. So should I judge you in like manner? I don't think you would like that.

Here is another question for you, even though you do not answer them. There are a few places where God says it is an abomination to send your children through the fire, so why then would you think God would turn around and send His children into the fiery pits of hell for eternity? Would that not be an abomination for Him to do this?

If we do not forgive others, if we do not love our enemies and do all the things Jesus says according to you we will go to hell. So where does God go when He does not forgive others or love His enemy?? Does He go to hell too?

When I was a young person I asked these questions and got kicked out of churches because they said I was of the devil, sorta like you are doing here. Your theories do not fit and you are allowing some religion or whatever to dumb you down. So you stay ignorant and spread lies about God just like those preachers when I was younger. If you do not have all the answers then you have not asked all the questions and you do not have all the information. Until then you are just a man who thinks he is more than a man. For you are not just in your judgment as Jesus tells us no man is just.

Something to think about..........

You said "You've fallen prey to another Jesus and another gospel, as so many have."

So you are saying I have fallen for another Jesus yet Jesus tells us seek and ye shall find. Is your evilness more powerful then Jesus that it would make Jesus a liar? For I seek Jesus daily and you say I have been deceived. You seek self importance and you find it in your website. Do we not find what we seek????? For I have seen how you attack others who do not believe as you do and it is not of Jesus but of an angry man. It is all over your website and your emails. You want people to follow you and what you teach and you refuse to learn anything.

Another thought if God created evil then would He not be doing as He teaches us not to do.


Ephesians 6:4King James Version (KJV)
4 And, ye fathers, provoke not your children to wrath: but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.

How is inflicting mankind with evil nurturing and teaching about the Lord. It would be a distraction to teaching about the Lord would it not? So according to you God put stumbling blocks in our way of what He teaches. He told Abram that He would not test man again, so how do you justify this?? Until you understand that God is love and everything He does is love you do not know God. Jesus tells us God clothes the animals and that is love so how can inflicting mankind with evil be loving? Simple it is not and saying God created evil is like satan is love.
Kee
 

Re: God created evil??????

Postby Victor Hafichuk » Sun Jan 18, 2015 4:06 pm



So, you haven't red the links I sent you.
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Re: God created evil??????

Postby Kee » Sun Jan 18, 2015 4:30 pm



You are very rude aren't you? I asked you questions and you cannot answer them. You do not even have the decency to make an attempt.

Something else to think about.

Jeremiah 32:35 And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.
36 And now therefore thus saith the Lord, the God of Israel, concerning this city, whereof ye say, It shall be delivered into the hand of the king of Babylon by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence;
37 Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:

Other places God calls it evil. So for God to send anyone to the fires od hell would be an abomination and evil. We are told to be perfect as God is perfect, so how is it an abomination for us to do it but you say God will burn His children in the fires of hell?

How is it that Jesus tells us to forgive our enemies and yet God does not. Oh that is right He sent Jesus to die on the cross for forgiveness of sins so God did forgive sins. When are you going to see you are nothing but a watered down catholic. Since the preaching of hell did not come about till Augustine you are following Augustine and the catholic religion. Before Catholicism hell was considered the separation from God we inflict on ourselves in this world. Once we die we become spiritual beings and as spiritual beings we are no longer separated from God. So the really important thing that Jesus did was free man from the grave (sleep) as the Jews knew it. Now when we die we are with God not asleep in the grave thanks to what Jesus did. Isn't it good that the GOOD NEWS is actually good.
Kee
 

Re: God created evil??????

Postby Victor Hafichuk » Fri Jan 23, 2015 8:58 am



“For the LORD God is a sun and shield; the LORD will give grace and glory; no good thing will He withhold from those who walk uprightly” (Psalms 84:11 MKJV).

I'm rude, Searingma? We can answer any questions you may have; none are at all difficult; you only need study at our site to see for yourself; all is on record.

You'll also readily find that what you accuse us of believing and teaching is not what we believe or teach - like eternal torment in flames. For example, you bring up the term The Good News. Read and repent and apologize for being a false accuser, you daughter of the accuser of Christ's brethren.

You are one foolish and wicked woman.

You don't have the ears or heart to receive. The wrath of God is on you and your house, afflictions you wouldn't have if you believed.

“And he said, If you will carefully listen to the voice of the LORD your God, and will do that which is right in His sight, and will give ear to His commandments, and keep all His Laws, I will put none of these diseases upon you, which I have brought upon the Egyptians; for I am the LORD Who heals you” (Exodus 15:26 MKJV).

You resist God in all your ways, being a know-it-all full of bitterness, implacable, combative, obnoxious, impudent…all of it.

How shall you expect God to speak to you or give His servants anything to give you when you are so wicked in all your ways? With zeal, you choose destruction, and destruction you have. So what more can I do for you? Not much. You don't believe. I have the unpleasantry and displeasure of watching you perish.

Victor Hafichuk
www.ThePathofTruth.com
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Re: God created evil??????

Postby Kee » Fri Jan 23, 2015 10:24 am



How is God punishing me? You are judging by man's judgment and as Jesus tells us there is only one who is just. That is why I place my life in His hands not man's foolish haughtiness.

Your drivel on your website is very hard to read because you get lost in your self righteousness.

But like so many religious junkies you get off on damning me to hell when you have no say in my life. God is the only one who can kill the soul and He refuses to do so, He is also the only one who could damn me to your imaginary hell and obviously He chooses not to as evident by God sending His Son to save the world, God's world not yours. If you were an example of who God really is I would rather burn in the pits of your made up hell then have to spend eternity with a hypocritical judgmental liar as you.

Jeremiah 32:35 And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.

36 And now therefore thus saith the Lord, the God of Israel, concerning this city, whereof ye say, It shall be delivered into the hand of the king of Babylon by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence;

37 Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:

Why will you not answer me how a God who tells His people it is an abomination to send their children through the fires and that He would never ask that of man, yet He will do so??? What kind of God is this that would do what He tells us not to after telling us to do as the Father does??? Sounds confusing doesn't it? Yet this is what you are suggesting will happen.
Hummm well I guess you are just another charlatan trying to con people into believing in a man made god and live in fear.
Kee
 

Re: God created evil??????

Postby Kee » Sun Jan 25, 2015 1:00 am



Beryl wrote:Searingma,

I've been reading your mail, which is shared among us. Years ago, I too, made the very same mistake you're making, right now! I attacked - BEFORE I red any information, that is so freely offered to all.

I only have one question for you... why should people believe what you have to say?

Beryl.



I attacked? Then you need to learn communication. I sent an email with my views and your boys accused me of being a demon and saying I did not know God but they did. Soumds like little boys who want a special toy all to themselves.

If you want people to see your point maybe you should stop seeing everything as an attack! You might be able to communicate your point better. After all being insulting as most of your website is, not to mention these emails, is not likely to win people over to your cause. I gave your bunch the benefit of the doubt by writing to you and trying to discuss it. But I got a very nasty response and do not see that they are anything like Jesus and thus am prone to blow you off as charlatans.

Jesus teaches us that evil does not come from a source it is based on knowledge,. Evil is an action not a being. For there to be evil there has to be knowledge. Just because someone has knowledge does not mean they are evil. So God giving man the knowledge does not make it that God created evil.

Your boys did not answer my question about how can God send His children to this fiery pit for eternity when God called it an abomination to send children through the fires? Jeremiah makes it plain that it is evil and yet so many religions follow catholics (Augustine's) teachings. If you want to know why you should believe what I say my answer is believe the Bible not someone who pulls a few verses out of context to justify their belief in a god of man. To say God created evil is to say God is not Love, He is only partial love. Jesus came to correct the prophets and you go to the OT instead of to what Jesus said. Before you balk look in Matthew where Jesus spoke of the Mosiac laws.

Matthew 19:
8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

It goes on to show Jesus did not agree with Mosaic law. This is a lot of what upsets the Jews. But Jesus in Matthew 19 also tells us to love our enemy not to hate our enemy. So why would Jesus tell us not to hate our enemy if evil was from God? If evil is from God then why would Jesus tells us to not do evil? For we are to do as the Father does. So we should then according to you create evil and thus hate our enemy. If we are to be as God - like Jesus told us to do, then according to your logic, we are to create evil. Now doesn't that sound a bit out there to you?

From what I can see from your website there are inconsistencies with your logic and thus it brings everything into question as God is not inconsistent. Thus if your logic is not consistent and does not fits together then it is not of God but of man. I was taught that God is love as Jesus taught and thus we are loved by God. You teach judgment and damnation to those who do not accept your ways. As evident by your boys' damnation of me. Jesus used logic and taught us to look to truth not jargon that might just maybe fit if you do not look at everything.

Your boys also accused me of not being learned enough. Your boys do not seem to understand that the Jews do not believe in eternal hell, nor does the Greek New Testament. It mentions Gehenna which was the pits where the Jews burned their trash and disposed of the poor's bodies. But it originated as the place of human sacrifice to the gods in the OT. So are you suggesting that Jesus will sacrifice us to the gods of this world? Because to take it literally that is what you would then believe. If you wish to take the bible literally, at least learn the Greek the NT was written in.

The pits to the Jews were seen as a disgrace and to be put in the pits was a disgrace. It was not a sign of eternal punishment as the catholics used it. Jesus used this to identify for the Jews what it was like to be separated from God - it was the worst thing the Jews knew. It would be the same as in modern terms being removed from your family and put in prison unjustly. He used what they knew to teach them not to make up some imaginary existence that results in eternal punishment. For God to send anyone to hell would be hating His enemies and not forgiving as Jesus told us to forgive everyone. So again it conflicts. Jesus tells us to forgive our enemies and yet God does not forgive according to your theory. So the question is do we do as you say God does and not forgive our enemies or do we do like Jesus teaches us and forgive our enemies. Since Jesus tells us to be as God then we can be assured that since He tells us to forgive our enemies then God must forgive His enemies also. If God were to not forgive anyone then He would be telling us to do differently then He does. This would make Jesus a liar and a fraud.

Do you see now how your logic is faulty and needs to be reconciled with Jesus not me or my belief? Even Paul taught that when anything conflicts with what Jesus taught go with what Jesus taught over the others. So are you going to follow Jesus or are you going to follow man and their faulty logic?

Remember to always follow Jesus
Kee
Kee
 

Re: God created evil??????

Postby Victor Hafichuk » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:09 am



Again, if you were to read what we really do teach, you would hide your face in shame for accusing us falsely and assuming things that simply aren't true. You show yourself for the damned fool you are, Carrie.

Do you not suffer consequences for your evil ways, “ME”? How about your children? How are they? Do you think these things happen in a vacuum?

“As the bird by wandering, as the swallow by flying, so the curse without cause shall not come” (Proverbs 26:2 MKJV).

You are responsible for the evils in your life, but you won't take responsibility for them. You deny and blaspheme the God you profess to believe. Do you honestly think we don't know what we're talking about? Being such a damned fool, likely so.

Nobody's damning you to hell here; search the materials and show us where we've done any such thing. However, we are telling you you're already damned and in hell, with death accompanying, even as the Scriptures plainly declare. Having a problem with that, you'll have to take it up with the Lord. You have never placed yourself in His hands, not in your wildest dreams. You lie.

You're searing all right, in conscience and conduct; seething, as well, and for what? Just to be vicious? To show off your bitter venom? Is that something one should be proud of? Is that helping you or anyone else?

Can you forever deny reality and the consequence for resisting it? Really? Think about it. But you won't - you're so bitter, hopping mad and irrational you have no hope of opportunity for changing the way you are.

So go your way, angry, slanderous, lying and heedless woman; continue to accumulate and increase your curses you even now suffer. There'll be more, I assure you; the way you act, it can't be otherwise. God isn't mocked; one will surely reap what she sows; it's Law.

Victor Hafichuk
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Re: God created evil??????

Postby Kee » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:49 am



This is the problem! I tried reading your stuff and this is what I got out of it. I brought to you questions and you keep referring me back to your website that is not readable. Then I get pounced on because I gave my take on your site and asked questions. You have not answered any of my questions instead you have attacked me with your damnation. Then Beryl comes out acting all pious and maybe like he was trying to help. So I gave him my take on it. Now here comes the bad cop pouncing again.

I get it you see asking questions as a threat. If anyone defends themselves it is a threat. If anyone even tries to have a discussion it is an attack. Got it boys.
Maybe you should think about your confrontational attitude before you try telling others that they are damned. If your hateful attitude is what one gets from knowing your god - no thank you, you can keep your hatefulness.

Beryl notice how angry people get when they have no answers to questions? I have gotten this from churches since I was a kid. They lie and when they get caught in their lies they attack and blame the person who asked.

In Victor's search he missed that the name Searing is my husband's family name not a commentary, but he was looking for any insult he could find wasn't he? It missed the mark darling. It just showed the bitterness and ignorance of anger.
Since Jesus has forgiven us our sins, He had to judge our sins. Jeremiah tells us the iniquities are forgotten when the covenant was sealed with the blood of the Lamb-Jesus. Yet you say judgment is coming. Then you are the ones calling God a liar. For how can He judge what has been forgiven-forgotten?
Oops there is a question, wait for the explosion................
KEE
Kee
 


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